There are certain items for which domestic airlines will probably never charge, like strollers and child safety seats. Cashing in on babies is just seen as tacky by most airline passengers. So when Continental Airlines inadvertently billed Greg Sykes for his child’s car seat, he expected a quick refund.
That didn’t happen.
I was as surprised as Sykes by this, because I had begun to believe Continental’s customer service was head and shoulders above the other legacy carriers.
Here’s Sykes’ story:
Recently, my wife and infant son traveled with Continental Airlines from Detroit to Houston and back again.
We were charged for a car seat on the departing trip, even though the published Continental policy was to not charge for a car seat when it is the first or second piece of luggage. The car seat was checked as my son’s only piece of luggage (even though our son is less than two years old, we purchased his ticket for the luggage allowance and for the additional space on the plane).
The skycap in Houston realized that the car seat charge was in error and prevented a repeat charge on the return trip.
When I contacted Continental I was told that the situation needed to be resolved before the flight occurred. So, I can either not pay the charge and not travel with my luggage (the carseat) or I can pay the charge and live with it. I’ve sent Continental an e-mail regarding this situation but I don’t expect to receive any response.
Please let others know just how intractable and absolute Continental personnel can be. Maybe someone else will remember to print a copy of the airline luggage policy, or other relevant policy, and can resolve these little situations by using the company’s own words. Hopefully, this experience can help prevent anyone else being blindsided by company personnel who don’t know their company’s policy.
Let’s have a look at Continental’s rules on car seats:
One of the following infant articles may be carried on board, in addition to the maximum carry-on baggage allowance:
Diaper Bag
Small Collapsible Stroller (space permitting)
Government-Approved Child Seat (infant carrying seat or car seat)
Strollers and Car Seats as Checked Baggage
Continental accepts one stroller or one car seat in addition to a customer’s baggage allowance. When checked as baggage, all oversize and overweight charges will apply. First and second bag fees do not apply to either a stroller or a car seat. Continental is not liable for damage to strollers. Excess Valuation may not be purchased for strollers.
Here’s the whole policy.
I don’t understand why Continental wouldn’t just refund the luggage fee if it admits the charge was an error. So I asked the airline.
A spokeswoman contacted me, and assured me the case had been solved.
“It appears that he was incorrectly charged,” she told me. “Our customer care department contacted Mr. Sykes and refunded the charge.”
I have a few observations. When Sykes said, “I’ve sent Continental an e-mail regarding this situation but I don’t expect to receive any response,” he may or may not have been correct.
Here are some Continental contacts, and if you don’t hear back from them in a week, you’re probably correct — you won’t hear back from them at all.
The airline was correct to suggest Sykes deal with the refund while he was still at the airport. It’s always better to take care of a customer-service problem right then and there. But that was no excuse to keep this customer’s money.
Airlines insist that we follow their rules to the letter. It isn’t unreasonable for us to expect them to follow theirs, too.
(Photo: sheeshoo/Flickr Creative Commons)
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Heh, RyanAir charges for it:
http://www.ryanair.com/en/questions/table-of-fees
Infant Equipment* (car/booster/travel cot) Fee charged per Item/ Per One Way Flight (1 pushchair carried free of charge) £10/€10 Booked on http://www.ryanair.com, £20/€20 via phone.
I hope Continental doesn’t let this happen again. Things like this can quickly add-up and create unnecessary trouble.
I’m sorry, BUT, the man purchased an airplane seat for his under-2 child, “for the luggage allowance and extra space.” Fine, great, forget that it also gives you the opportunity to insure your child’s SAFETY. If you BROUGHT a car safety seat, why, oh, why on EARTH would you check it (for free or not) instead of bringing it on board and USING it in the seat you PURCHASED for your child? Making the whole “they charged me a baggage fee for a car seat and they shouldn’t have and now I want my money back” thing MOOT. I mean, really, THAT’S the issue.
This is a real sore spot with me. I’m both a flight attendant and a mother. Last year, when the plane went off the runway in Denver on its way to Houston, there was a mom on board with an infant on her lap and a barely-over-2 next to her in the seat she is required to purchase for him but NOT in a safety seat. (Maybe it was checked and therefore in cargo, where it does NO GOOD for the child.) Her quote, when she described the accident, was something like, “The baby just FLEW out of my arms and my toddler toppled over.” Well, of COURSE they did. Airplane seats, like automobile seats, aren’t configured to safety restrain the body of a toddler; that’s WHY car safety seats were INVENTED. I know that this isn’t the topic of this thread, but good grief! We’ve got a parent here more concerned with getting his baggage fee refunded than he is with his child’s safety.
Maybe it is tacky. Iwould rather see them charge fees for these services then to see them charge for water,snacks and soft drinks. Make it a hefty fee
to discourgae infants and toddlers from flying. It is much fairer than charging for checked in baggage which use to be free.
Toni are we having a bad day???? :)
I actually had the same thought as Toni as I read the article. They took the time to purchase a seat for their child AND they brought the car seat along with them, but instead of using it on the plane, they checked it?
Sorry to hear that Continental did not follow their own baggage policies and that they had to fight to get their money back for something they should’ve been charged. It’s really sad when you need to show up at the airport with a printed list of your airline’s policies because their employees don’t know or follow them.
I’m with Toni on this one. I can’t think of a single good reason to be checking a car seat for a ticketed kid.
I know it’s a pain to lug a car seat through the airport (I’ve got a 2 and 4 year old)–just get one of those SmarteCartes (yes, you can take them through security) to help.
Are all car seats approved for use on an airplane? It has been several years since my son needed a car seat but I remember getting some pointed questions about bringing a car seat on the plane. First, of course, I was told it was not allowed without the extra ticket, which I did always have. Then the FA wanting to see the certification label on the seat. All of which held up the passengers behind me, but it was worth it because he slept like a little angel for every flight.
Why don’t the airlines encourage people to bring the seats on board especially when one has purchased the extra ticket?
When they tried to charge me to check the car seat, I would have just carried it on and used it!
You’re right, Barbie. It is tacky. Soooo … your solution to the whole issue of baggage fees is to bar infants and toddlers from planes? I’ve have my share of bad flights attributable to cyring kids, etc., but banning them from planes isn’t going to solve anything. I mean, what would you have them do? Have a sign at the jetway door, like you see at the amusement park? “You have to be this tall to ride on the plane.”
@Christopher – you wrote:
“The airline was correct to suggest Sykes deal with the refund while he was still at the airport. It’s always better to take care of a customer-service problem right then and there.”
You often include a similar statement in your troubleshooting articles. And I agree – it is always best…IF you can do that. But that’s the problem – it seems to me that in a vast majority of these cases, the traveler tried to resolve it, and was unable.
It’s important to remember just how stressful travel is these days: long security lines just to get IN the airport; more lines to get your luggage checked, then through security to the gate; cranky power-hungry TSA agents; confusing and ever-changing rules and regulations; and your plane is leaving whether you get through all the lines in time or not.
And in this case, it’s even MORE understandable: a family traveling with a young child, and an intractable agent who wouldn’t listen. Remember, that plane is LEAVING – you don’t always have the time to argue until you get your way, even if you are 100% right.
With that in mind, it’s even more shocking that Continental took that stance – fix it before you fly, or you’re stuck. That’s just so wrong, on so many levels. What did they think his options were? Get into a screaming argument with the agent? What was he supposed to do, punch the agent in the mouth?
The realities of travel these days are that “they” (meaning everyone who is running the show – gate agents, TSA agents, flight attendents, etc. etc.) have all the power. If we want to get to our destination, we really have to just behave like meek little following sheep and do what everyone tells us. To get into an argument with an agent, when the time is ticking away before you plane leaves, is just not realistic.
So anyway, thanks for being there to always help us poor beleaguered mistreated passengers.
And I just gotta say, as a parent, how TIRED I am of seeing snarky comments about parents travling with their kids. My kids have just as much right to be on a plane as anyone else.
@ Toni:
I sometimes fly with my child who is over 2 and required to have his own seat. The last time we flew I had every intention of putting him in is car seat on the plane. But when we arrived there we were informed by the gate agent that the seat was not approved for air travel, and we would have to gate check it. We do not fly often enough for this to have been an issue when purchasing the seat. So maybe he planned on using the seat, maybe he was unable. Maybe he knew his seat was not airline approved, and therefore had to check it.
My suggestion to avoid any accidental fee, bring it to the gate anyway. At least there you can gate check it if you can’t use it.
Airlines are in business to make a profit. Their profit translates into dividends for the stockholders who invested with the hopes of making a profit. No I do not own any airline stock. It is tacky to charge passengers for a water a soft drink or a checked bag. These are items which used to be free. However a child under 2 is a nonpaying customer period. No profit period. Why not charge for it. buy your own. We because we cannot bring water on board ourselves must pay. As for fa, they are doing their job as best they can 99 percent of the time. Let them do their job and do not attemp t to intefere with performance whatever you might think. Quite a bit of complaints on the TSA is fabricated for attention. That does not mean I like them . Flying is your choice. It is not your right. Dont like it find an alternative.
Now that my youngest is 4, we check the car seat if we need to bring it on the trip. We bring it for the car rides at our destination, not the actual plane trips. That’s why one reason a person might bring a car seat but not use it in flight. Also, other posters are right that they are not all approved for use in planes. I mostly fly Delta and they have never charged us for checking the car seat, even in error. Imagine Delta being better at another airline about anything!
Does Barbie really think the airlines would want to do ANYTHING to discourage someone from buying a seat, even if it is for an infant or toddler? I think not.
Sorry Frosty; No way is or should discourage a paying fare. Remember also you do not have a right to fly ; it is a privilege as in a drivers license. If the TSA puts you on a do not fly list tough; If the FA believes you or your child is impeding the safety of the plane tough. Just follow directions simple.
barbie, I really do not understand your last 2 comments. They really have nothing to do with the topic at hand, which was being charged for something the airline policy in place said was free. It matters not wether the seat was approved for air travel or not. Fact is, the seat was purchased, and in accordance with policies the seat should have been able to be checked free of charge. That is the point here, not wether someone did or didn’t put a child into the seat on the plane, or any of the ramblings about shareholders and profit.
Whoa…now hold on a minute! barbie45, you can’t possibly be saying that someone who gets wrongly put on a TSA no-fly list should just shut up and take it? I have no clue how that thought even got in here – it has nothing to do with this topic. But that is by far one of the strangest comments I’ve ever read in here! You really believe that the TSA should have the unassailable right to just bar some poor citizen from flying…ever? And just….tough?
Wow. I can’t even fathom the brain behind this type of thinking. I suppose you also feel that the government should have the right to just walk into our homes, take our personal belongings, throw us in prison with no trial, rape and pillage and basically do whatever the heck they want because…well…they’re the government and we have no rights.
I can only assume you are not American. In fact, I’d say that’s pretty much a sure thing, since it’s obvious that English is not your first language – you can’t seem to write a readable sentence. So, just to help you understand where the rest of us are coming from: we here in America believe in freedom. We are actually granted freedom in our Constitution. We do have rights…and yes, we even have the right to travel by plane, provided we pay for our ticket. I don’t know what things are like in your country, but we actually treasure our freedom here.
By the way, just to point out another nonsensical comment you made – not all children under 2 are non-paying customers. In fact, if you’d actually read the article above, about which you are spewing such nonsensical comments, you would see that these parents DID pay for their child’s ticket. So these children do have just as much RIGHT (yes, you read that word correctly) to be on those planes as you do.
I swear, some of the comments on this blog are just…well, they are not even readable, much less understandable.
Mike, I’ve been watching these comments for a long time. With that person, it’s par for the course. I don’t think we’re dealing with a normally-thinking adult here. And you and I are not the only ones who’ve noticed.
You’re not going to get anything but pure nonsense spilling out of that particular keyboard. It’s probably best just to ignore her, since actual intelligent communication seems impossible.
Barbie: An appropriate moniker.
Take a quick refesher course in basic English and grammar (punctuation is your friend) before you try making an argument, logical or otherwise, on any subject. Otherwise you sound like, well, like the Barbie you no doubtedly are.
I’d like to see gate agents checking birth certificates on the “under 2 years old lap children.” I flew last week and was seated in front of a family who held a kid who must have been 4 or 5 on their lap just to avoid the fee. There was NO SPACE (this was a ComAir Jet) for this kid. It was totally unsafe.
First off: I live in Europe, I don’t know if the US rules for car seats are different.
In Europe there are “baby car seats – 0-13 kg” and “toddler car seats – 9-25 kg”. Baby car seats are the basket-like baby-lying-down things, toddler seats are chair-like monstrosities. There’s no way you could fit a toddler car seat in an aeroplane seat.
My kid grew out of his baby car seat when he was 9 months old. Maybe Baby Sykes was a big kid too, maybe that’s Dad Sykes checked the car seat? Whatever the reason, it doesn’t change anything about the first issue here: Continental incorrectly charging money for the car seat and refusing a completely legitimate claim for a refund. Personally, I’m an easily pissed-off customer and an episode like this would put Continental on my personal no-fly list for a loooong time.
RegularJoe, I’ve been seeing her comments sprinkled all over this site for months.
Trust me, you are not going to get anything but “otherwise.” Normal human logic does not appear to be among her skillsets.
Raven you are correct.By the way I am an American citizen. I am very proud of that. Also what could be easier for the most part than getting on a plane. I am sure if you are placed on a no fly list you have recourses open to you. I am sure that nine-nine percent of people flying have no problems. Just follow directions, do not have an attitude you will be fine. Remember flying is not a right it is a privilege.I will not even venture to guess the number of flights hassle free I have taken more than most of you.I can also recall steward and and stewardess being used. Also free booze.in coach.
Merlin ; nothing to do with topic.
Oh. My. God. Now that one made me laugh. Nothing to do with the topic? My dear, you are the queen of nothing-to-do-with-the-topic comments. You are actually legendary for them. My friends and I, who read this column regularly, often sit around and laugh ourselves silly over your latest nonsense.
We do enjoy the entertainment value. But we feed badly for poor Mr. Elliott, whose otherwise intelligent comments forum is rendered pretty much useless by your non-English, non-sensical, non-topical non-comments.
And frankly, the fact that you are American makes this whole situation even scarier.
@Frostysnowman, @Mike, @RegularJoe, @Merlin, and all the rest of you who are tired of the invasion of this site:
Sigh……
I feel your pain. Believe me. It’s sad. And I too wish Christopher would do something about it. I asked him to. But he has made his position clear: that all comments are welcome, no matter how moronic, off-topic, offensive, and utterly unreadable. I have since determined that it’s best just to ignore her. We thinking humans who speak normal English really can have intelligent conversations. We have to just zap over the ones that are filled with meaningless drivel.
This comments thread has become quite diverted from the original article. The fact is that the original article had nothing whatsoever to do with whether or not someone should check a carseat or bring it onboard. Neither did have anything to do with buying tickets for children, or if parents shouldn’t even bring children on flights (and as a parent, I find that suggestion to be offensive). It’s definitely not about TSA no-fly lists, or whether air travel is a right or a priviledge.
It’s about the simple fact that Continental broke its own stated policy and charged a passenger improperly for something that should have been checked for free. And when the passenger rightfully asked for his money back, they actually had the audacity to say NO – for the incomprehensible reason that he hadn’t been able to strong-arm the agent who initially improperly charged him, not to charge him! The twisted logic there defies explanation.
Once again, Christopher managed to ride in on his white horse and get the airline to own up to its mistake and make it right. Thank goodness we have him. But the fact that they wouldn’t do it the first time the customer asked is bad enough. Shame on them for even making that argument to begin with!
@Barbie, please stay on topic. Thanks.
You folks may not believe when I say this, but…I rather agree with Barbie only on the idea that flying is a “privilege” rather than a “right” as many seem to believe. If anything, your right is only as good as your ability to enforce it, especially on those who don’t agree with it, and those rights are essentially dictated by any applicable law and/or agreement. (e.g. contract of carriage)
Of course, that’s a somewhat topic off from the one Chris E wrote about here. Just setting that aside.
Anyway, what LeeAnne commented is also a dilemma. While I also agree with Chris’ suggestion to deal with the issue on the spot, not everyone has that so-called luxury when one needs to board ASAP.
And yeah, I don’t understand either why the Continental folks wouldn’t just resolve the issue there and then without Chris’ intervention. Especially when they themselves seemingly acknowledged it.
Sigh.
Barbie wrote:
“Remember also you do not have a right to fly ; it is a privilege as in a drivers license.”
Whoa!! That’s quite a statement. I’ll agree it’s not a right, but I SURE wouldn’t call flying these days a “priviledge”. It’s more like a “grit-your-teeth and get thru it” experience that you have to subject yourself to in order to get to your vacation.
Probably why I’m gonna take the “Auto-Train” to Florida in Feb.
Chris:
You noted “The airline was correct to suggest Sykes deal with the refund while he was still at the airport.”
However, that’s not what the airline said. The customer flew from Detroit to Houston – and only THEN was it discovered, by an alert porter, that the charge was in error. Continental didn’t say “deal with it while you were still at the airport”; he “was told that the situation needed to be resolved before the flight occurred”–in other words, his only recourse was gone before the error was discovered.
And of course, once you get involved, they fall all over themselves to distance themselves from what their own representatives told the passenger. It should be clear by now that even Continental, which used to stand above the crowd, kind of like a midget among pygmies, is subject to the same kind of short-sighted money-grubbing fee myopia that has spread like a virus through the entire Plestiocene airline management ranks.
Don’t know how they paid, but absent a reply or refund in a timely manner (i.e., by the end of the credit card billing cycle) I’d dispute the charge.
Also, not all car seats are FAA approved. People bring and check them so that they can use them in a car on arrival. As to why the airlines don’t have approved seats available for children on paid tickets I have no clue.