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	<title>Comments on: Gone but not forgotten: how one airline quietly deleted our rights</title>
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	<link>http://www.elliott.org/blog/gone-but-not-forgotten-how-one-airline-quietly-deleted-our-rights/</link>
	<description>Consumer advocate Christopher Elliott&#039;s site.</description>
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		<title>By: Chuck</title>
		<link>http://www.elliott.org/blog/gone-but-not-forgotten-how-one-airline-quietly-deleted-our-rights/comment-page-1/#comment-7407</link>
		<dc:creator>Chuck</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 26 Dec 2007 12:00:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.elliott.org/blog/gone-but-not-forgotten-how-one-airline-quietly-deleted-our-rights/#comment-7407</guid>
		<description>I think the more onerous little &quot;surprise&quot; that US Air has established is the way they handle exchanges; if your old ticket had a value of 700, and the new ticket has a value of 250, they keep the change. There is no residual value voucher for future travel, no refund, no nothing.  Take it or leave it, they don&#039;t care because they have your money!!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think the more onerous little &#8220;surprise&#8221; that US Air has established is the way they handle exchanges; if your old ticket had a value of 700, and the new ticket has a value of 250, they keep the change. There is no residual value voucher for future travel, no refund, no nothing.  Take it or leave it, they don&#8217;t care because they have your money!!</p>
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		<title>By: Jesse</title>
		<link>http://www.elliott.org/blog/gone-but-not-forgotten-how-one-airline-quietly-deleted-our-rights/comment-page-1/#comment-7253</link>
		<dc:creator>Jesse</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 20 Dec 2007 19:27:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.elliott.org/blog/gone-but-not-forgotten-how-one-airline-quietly-deleted-our-rights/#comment-7253</guid>
		<description>I wanted to make a point about the lightening your load comment from Kairho.

My suitcase weights about 25 pounds itself...so think about that one.

I could use a lighter one, but I would rather get my stuff later than have the suitcase rip into pieces during baggage handling. We all know that those airport handlers do such a good job that I would rather not take the risk.

Another thing is that nobody thinks about the stopover for the kiddies until THEY ARE IN THE SITUATION THEMSELVES. Heck, I don&#039;t care about kids traveling by themselves, I don&#039;t know how it works, I don&#039;t have any kids I don&#039;t care, but I tell you that I will once I have Jr and Jr2.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I wanted to make a point about the lightening your load comment from Kairho.</p>
<p>My suitcase weights about 25 pounds itself&#8230;so think about that one.</p>
<p>I could use a lighter one, but I would rather get my stuff later than have the suitcase rip into pieces during baggage handling. We all know that those airport handlers do such a good job that I would rather not take the risk.</p>
<p>Another thing is that nobody thinks about the stopover for the kiddies until THEY ARE IN THE SITUATION THEMSELVES. Heck, I don&#8217;t care about kids traveling by themselves, I don&#8217;t know how it works, I don&#8217;t have any kids I don&#8217;t care, but I tell you that I will once I have Jr and Jr2.</p>
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		<title>By: Kairho</title>
		<link>http://www.elliott.org/blog/gone-but-not-forgotten-how-one-airline-quietly-deleted-our-rights/comment-page-1/#comment-7245</link>
		<dc:creator>Kairho</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 20 Dec 2007 13:49:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.elliott.org/blog/gone-but-not-forgotten-how-one-airline-quietly-deleted-our-rights/#comment-7245</guid>
		<description>Based only on what you wrote above, Chris, I am not all that troubled by most of these changes.  Addressing only these five, and without following up in the COC:

No more freebie cancellations.  I fail to see any significant difference between the old and new working.  Cancelling or not purchasing seem to have the same end result maybe with some lowered admin costs on the part of US. 

No more O2.  Based on observation few people these days carry around O2 and those  portable units are becoming quite common.  Users are still able to get the benefits and the airline no longer has to stock, refill and manage soon-to-be outdated equipment.

No stopovers for the kiddies.  This is a very good thing.  Many advocates say nonstop flights only should be used for UMs.  If someone requires connections, hire a nanny to accompany.

Canada? Mexico? What’s the difference? No opinion on this one.

Lighten your load. Would it not be a change from 140 to 100 pounds?  One hundred pounds is still a lot and the change is consistent with new industry practices.  Although I won&#039;t go to the mat on this one, it is understandable for fuel savings and ease of baggage handling.  US is not a moving company and 100 is still a heck of a lot more than most international airlines.  On at least one airline the 70 pound limit (and 3 such bags) is a perq for their elite fliers.

No more kitties in cargo.  Good.  Handling of animals is getting worse and worse as the airlines get busier and busier. Many people wouldn&#039;t ever consider transporting animals as cargo and it has extreme health and psychological consequences.  There are companies which specialize in animal transport who do a fine job and will ensure safe transport.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Based only on what you wrote above, Chris, I am not all that troubled by most of these changes.  Addressing only these five, and without following up in the COC:</p>
<p>No more freebie cancellations.  I fail to see any significant difference between the old and new working.  Cancelling or not purchasing seem to have the same end result maybe with some lowered admin costs on the part of US. </p>
<p>No more O2.  Based on observation few people these days carry around O2 and those  portable units are becoming quite common.  Users are still able to get the benefits and the airline no longer has to stock, refill and manage soon-to-be outdated equipment.</p>
<p>No stopovers for the kiddies.  This is a very good thing.  Many advocates say nonstop flights only should be used for UMs.  If someone requires connections, hire a nanny to accompany.</p>
<p>Canada? Mexico? What’s the difference? No opinion on this one.</p>
<p>Lighten your load. Would it not be a change from 140 to 100 pounds?  One hundred pounds is still a lot and the change is consistent with new industry practices.  Although I won&#8217;t go to the mat on this one, it is understandable for fuel savings and ease of baggage handling.  US is not a moving company and 100 is still a heck of a lot more than most international airlines.  On at least one airline the 70 pound limit (and 3 such bags) is a perq for their elite fliers.</p>
<p>No more kitties in cargo.  Good.  Handling of animals is getting worse and worse as the airlines get busier and busier. Many people wouldn&#8217;t ever consider transporting animals as cargo and it has extreme health and psychological consequences.  There are companies which specialize in animal transport who do a fine job and will ensure safe transport.</p>
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		<title>By: Joe F.</title>
		<link>http://www.elliott.org/blog/gone-but-not-forgotten-how-one-airline-quietly-deleted-our-rights/comment-page-1/#comment-7244</link>
		<dc:creator>Joe F.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 20 Dec 2007 13:23:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.elliott.org/blog/gone-but-not-forgotten-how-one-airline-quietly-deleted-our-rights/#comment-7244</guid>
		<description>What is interesting is many people buy airline tickets months in advance - which set of rules apply?  If they change the rules in midstream, does that not mean you should be entitled to a refund.  Or the old rules - or new rules - or intermediate rules?  

I believe the industry is ripe for multiple consumer class actions that will change the landscape dramatically - cruises, airlines, all of whom see their customers as the enemy.  From the gate agents and flight attendants right through the corporate offices - the customers are the enemy.  

My NEXT big question is tipping on cruise ships.  The company gives you &#039;suggested tips
 per person per day per cabin.&#039;  The tip implies that the employee keeps the money- like other tips.  So - do they?  Keep the money?  If you pay $3.50 per person per day, that comes to $50 for a week cruise for two people.  12 cabins per employee is $600 a week.  That is VERY good money for someone from Indonesia or other popular locations.  Taking into account that cruise lines add 15-18% tips for ALL purchases made on board, there is tons of tip money - and where is it going?  It is once again misleading to assume that the cabin steward and his assistants [who already make $700-900 a month] are splitting another $600 a week.  It is naive to think that the cruise company is not pocketing a big chunk of that money - given how corporate America and corporate world operates.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What is interesting is many people buy airline tickets months in advance &#8211; which set of rules apply?  If they change the rules in midstream, does that not mean you should be entitled to a refund.  Or the old rules &#8211; or new rules &#8211; or intermediate rules?  </p>
<p>I believe the industry is ripe for multiple consumer class actions that will change the landscape dramatically &#8211; cruises, airlines, all of whom see their customers as the enemy.  From the gate agents and flight attendants right through the corporate offices &#8211; the customers are the enemy.  </p>
<p>My NEXT big question is tipping on cruise ships.  The company gives you &#8216;suggested tips<br />
 per person per day per cabin.&#8217;  The tip implies that the employee keeps the money- like other tips.  So &#8211; do they?  Keep the money?  If you pay $3.50 per person per day, that comes to $50 for a week cruise for two people.  12 cabins per employee is $600 a week.  That is VERY good money for someone from Indonesia or other popular locations.  Taking into account that cruise lines add 15-18% tips for ALL purchases made on board, there is tons of tip money &#8211; and where is it going?  It is once again misleading to assume that the cabin steward and his assistants [who already make $700-900 a month] are splitting another $600 a week.  It is naive to think that the cruise company is not pocketing a big chunk of that money &#8211; given how corporate America and corporate world operates.</p>
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		<title>By: Debbie</title>
		<link>http://www.elliott.org/blog/gone-but-not-forgotten-how-one-airline-quietly-deleted-our-rights/comment-page-1/#comment-7237</link>
		<dc:creator>Debbie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 20 Dec 2007 03:13:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.elliott.org/blog/gone-but-not-forgotten-how-one-airline-quietly-deleted-our-rights/#comment-7237</guid>
		<description>I&#039;d gladly pay $1 to have someone looking out for me. It&#039;s becoming harder and harder to fly - too many delays, overcrowded cabins, too little amenities for what we pay, etc. Problem is, flying is often the only way to get somewhere (Europe anyone?). I DID NOT know about the pet policy, which upsets me. I have three cats and am hoping to move to Europe in the next couple of years - so what do I do? I&#039;m even more agitated as I am a USAirways credit card holder (both debit and credit) and Dividend Miles member! Websites like this are great and I am not one for government interference, but they have been sleeping on this big time!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;d gladly pay $1 to have someone looking out for me. It&#8217;s becoming harder and harder to fly &#8211; too many delays, overcrowded cabins, too little amenities for what we pay, etc. Problem is, flying is often the only way to get somewhere (Europe anyone?). I DID NOT know about the pet policy, which upsets me. I have three cats and am hoping to move to Europe in the next couple of years &#8211; so what do I do? I&#8217;m even more agitated as I am a USAirways credit card holder (both debit and credit) and Dividend Miles member! Websites like this are great and I am not one for government interference, but they have been sleeping on this big time!</p>
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		<title>By: Jennifer</title>
		<link>http://www.elliott.org/blog/gone-but-not-forgotten-how-one-airline-quietly-deleted-our-rights/comment-page-1/#comment-7229</link>
		<dc:creator>Jennifer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 19 Dec 2007 22:23:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.elliott.org/blog/gone-but-not-forgotten-how-one-airline-quietly-deleted-our-rights/#comment-7229</guid>
		<description>If the contracts are available on airlines&#039; sites, in HTML format, then there are automated solutions.  Websites like &lt;a href=&quot;http://changealarm.businessmatter.com&quot;&gt; ChangeAlarm&lt;/a&gt;, &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.changedetection.com&quot;&gt;ChangeDetection&lt;/a&gt; , or &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.changenotes.com&quot;&gt;ChangeNotes&lt;/a&gt; will notify you by email of any changes to any web page.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If the contracts are available on airlines&#8217; sites, in HTML format, then there are automated solutions.  Websites like <a href="http://changealarm.businessmatter.com"> ChangeAlarm</a>, <a href="http://www.changedetection.com">ChangeDetection</a> , or <a href="http://www.changenotes.com">ChangeNotes</a> will notify you by email of any changes to any web page.</p>
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		<title>By: Christopher Elliott</title>
		<link>http://www.elliott.org/blog/gone-but-not-forgotten-how-one-airline-quietly-deleted-our-rights/comment-page-1/#comment-7226</link>
		<dc:creator>Christopher Elliott</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 19 Dec 2007 20:17:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.elliott.org/blog/gone-but-not-forgotten-how-one-airline-quietly-deleted-our-rights/#comment-7226</guid>
		<description>I&#039;d pay $1 for that!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;d pay $1 for that!</p>
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		<title>By: Jesse</title>
		<link>http://www.elliott.org/blog/gone-but-not-forgotten-how-one-airline-quietly-deleted-our-rights/comment-page-1/#comment-7224</link>
		<dc:creator>Jesse</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 19 Dec 2007 19:27:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.elliott.org/blog/gone-but-not-forgotten-how-one-airline-quietly-deleted-our-rights/#comment-7224</guid>
		<description>$1.00 per leg to fund a consumer agency in charge of fighting with airlines (and government) for our &quot;rights&quot;? Anyone?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>$1.00 per leg to fund a consumer agency in charge of fighting with airlines (and government) for our &#8220;rights&#8221;? Anyone?</p>
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		<title>By: Jacob (Fusiler)</title>
		<link>http://www.elliott.org/blog/gone-but-not-forgotten-how-one-airline-quietly-deleted-our-rights/comment-page-1/#comment-7223</link>
		<dc:creator>Jacob (Fusiler)</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 19 Dec 2007 18:16:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.elliott.org/blog/gone-but-not-forgotten-how-one-airline-quietly-deleted-our-rights/#comment-7223</guid>
		<description>If I were a good web designer/database builder, I would take you up on this in an instant. Maybe just a site that rates airlines according to restrictions and makes updates to new passenger agreements painfully public (like this post)?

Great stuff!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If I were a good web designer/database builder, I would take you up on this in an instant. Maybe just a site that rates airlines according to restrictions and makes updates to new passenger agreements painfully public (like this post)?</p>
<p>Great stuff!</p>
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